Second Chance Queen

Kristianna Mrjenovich (00:01)
Welcome back to the next episode of Second Chance Queen. Tonight we are going to be interviewing Whitley Nabintu

who is in the pageantry world, one of my idols. So I'm super excited to be interviewing her tonight. Whitley Nabintu Marshall is a multifaceted force in the realms of art, fashion, dance, and activism.

As the first openly pansexual international Mrs. USA of 2022 and Mrs. Florida USA Earth 2024, she embodies diversity and inclusivity in all facets of her work. As the CEO and editor in chief of Art Love Lifestyle Magazine and the creative mind behind Art Love Lifestyle Attire, Whitley is on a mission to redefine beauty standards and amplify underrepresented

voices, both in print and on the runway. Through sustainable fashion events like Flowers That Feed Art and Fashion Showcase and True Beauty New York Fashion Week, she creates platforms that celebrate compassion, resilience, diversity, and authenticity, while emphasizing inclusion. Despite facing multiple near -death experiences and periods of adversity, Whitley has transformed her pain into purpose, spearheading the Compassionate Leadership Project.

Additionally, she is the founder and director of the Rhythm Rebels Dance Collective, captivating audiences worldwide with her performances. Through her mind, body, compassion coaching, Whitley adopts a holistic approach to empower her clients, aiming to cultivate authentic and compassionate leaders within pageantry, the fashion industry, and beyond. Her impact extends beyond her professional endeavors,

as she graces the covers of

magazines such as

success, Forbes, Los Angeles business, and more. Recognized as a top women leader to watch and an official nominee for Beauty It's Everywhere, Misses of the Year 2023, Whitley's accolades include the Director's Leadership Award, the Inspirational Woman Award, Congeniality Award, and the Spirit Award presented by Pageantry Magazine, among others. Whitley's dedication to fostering compassion, resilience, and inclusion serves as an inspiration

to individuals worldwide, making her a true trailblazer in her field. I am super excited for Whitley to join us tonight and to hear all about her Second Chance story.

thank you so much for joining me this evening. I'm super excited to interview you. You're probably one of my favorite people in the industry, so I'm really excited to have you on. So I would love to hear in your own words, your second chance defining story.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (02:33)
Happy

Thank you for having me. It's an honor to be here. I love what you're doing and your whole mission here. As far as my second chance, I've had a series of near -death experiences. But I would say the most defining moment is probably the car accident I was in when I was 18 years old. they thought I was going to die.

essentially I was driving in a blizzard and spun, got out of the tire tracks in the snow and spun into oncoming traffic and was hit on the passenger side and then again spun again around and they hit me again from the rear. within a couple minutes the car went up in flames too but it just happened to be that someone recognized the car that I was driving as my mom's from

church and pulled over and he was a paramedic and he was two cars behind me and pulled me out of the car. But I had, yeah that was a big game changer. I was 18. I would that

I was in school for studying art and psychology and that shifted my whole direction of life. ended up, I was supposed to start a job two days after that car accident because my whole plan was to like take a semester, pay off a semester, take a semester, pay off a semester. so that changed my whole direction. I ended up having living or being

hospital for about a month in the ICU then going to a rehab facility in a nursing home and living in a nursing home for a couple months and then having physical and occupational therapy at

nine months, essentially recovery for that. And so when I got well enough to work again, my sister was like, how about you come out to Maine? And because when are you going to have more than a week to visit me? So how about you? I'll help you get a temp job for the month for the holidays. And then we can go back and visit mom for the holidays. So we went and

She essentially convinced me to move to Maine. ended up, so from that car accident, I received multiple blood transfusions and that ended up shifting my direction or I guess sparking my interest in...

blood transfusion and transfusion medicine. And I ended up working for the American Red Cross for 16 years, starting out doing blood drives all around the state of Maine and then cross training and all different technologies for apheresis, which essentially is like, if you think of any type of blood component you could take, separate a whole blood product out into, that was essentially my

And then, but we do the medical screening, the physical exams, the phlebotomy, any responding, any reactions to any of those things. And, but essentially, drawing blood used as transfusion medicine. And I was a biomedical charge toward the end of my career. But

There's, I honestly think, I think the biggest like epiphany through that moment in general is through the biggest challenges that I've ever faced at every single one of them. Those have been the defining moments of my life of stepping further into purpose and learning my passions and really diving into that and just

for the lessons around that because I've found that everything, everyone has a different response to every situation and some of that's based off of personality, some of it's based off of trauma responses, some of it's based off of circumstance or mood in the moment.

we have choice in how we respond. And so when I really clicked, I feel like that moment really was defining for me. It felt very like karmic as well as...

purposeful. So even though I was like undergoing all this, had a new drive to live as well because I had a lot of life lived up until that moment already at 18. And so there is, you know, I just feel like that was a very defining moment for me.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (07:46)
Yeah.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (07:55)
Every challenge I feel like has had lessons that have moved me in the, again, more toward my passions, clarifying vision. I feel like there's good things and challenges in every situation. And so a lot of it's how you decide to be through those.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (08:18)
I agree and that's not the first time that I've heard of car accidents in particular being catalyst moments for people. feel like the universe has a very strange way of catapulting people into the right direction and sometimes I think traumatic experiences like a car accident or you know something that normally you'd be like this is really negative.

That's not the first time I've heard someone say that something really positive came out of a car accident. So I guess that's a great glass half full kind of way to look at

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (08:54)
Another big thing I think that came from it, I'm just thinking through is

it made me not fear death at all from that point because I have come so close to death so many times. I found that

Kristianna Mrjenovich (09:03)
Wow, that's an interesting perspective.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (09:11)
really in those moments. It's pretty cool what our bodies do actually to protect us from feeling the pain, but you can experience it kind of from the outside. Like I knew I was in pain. I knew I had things going on, but my body put myself in shock in that moment.

And so it's more of an out of body experience. Like even when I think of the car accident, it's more like time slowed down. So it just gave me different perspective on around death. I do think about death in an abnormal amount, I think, because of having so many experiences. But.

I think a lot of the positives is it's not a fearful thing. think I almost go in the opposite like morbid direction of like, that wouldn't be that bad of a way to die.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (09:58)
feel like when you have experiences like that though, it does definitely change your perspective. I've never been one that's feared death. I know a lot of people really do, but I've never been one that's feared death. I have an awkward fascination with it. Like serial killer documentaries. I've had moments in my life where I'm like, hmm, maybe I'm gonna wind up on a documentary right now.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (10:21)
I love learning about you.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (10:25)
But it's like, death is also such a big rebirth in a lot of ways. And I really wasn't afraid of death. And now I am more as a parent, definitely, because I'm not so much afraid of me dying, but I can't think of losing the ones that I love. But it's a very brave way to look at things, you know, most people would go and get that close to death and be like, no, I never want to. And you're just

Nah, you know, that might not be that bad. So I feel like that's a testament to how strong you are mentally because and I think you you definitely come off and you can correct me with this, but you definitely come off as more of an optimist in a lot of ways than a pessimist. And I kind of sense that in you because I'm the same way. Like the world can be falling around me and my husband.

My husband's a pessimist all the way. Like he will run around like a chicken with his head cut off and I'm just like, you know, but I'm still breathing and he's just like, So I feel like you're that same type of person where like things could be going on around you and you're just kind of like, you know, it could be worse.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (11:27)
you

It's true. I've experienced a lot of things from homelessness to food insecurity to living in Africa and in a third world area and working in a clinic. I've seen it. So I do a lot of the time have.

most of the time have a glass is half full and gratitude, I think a sense of gratitude for what I do have. Because I have both experienced less myself and seen others and far, far more challenging circumstances than I, to say the least. So.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (12:17)
That I think it brings me to my next talking point actually, because there's a word in your bio that I see multiple times and it's one of my favorite words and it's resilience. You, feel like embody resilience. If there was a human definition of resilience, I think your picture would be right next to it. But.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (12:39)
Hahaha

Kristianna Mrjenovich (12:43)
That brings me to the question, do you think you have a specific catalyst for being resilient? Would it be the same second chance story that you just told or is there something else that you think is really defined and molded you into a resilient

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (12:59)
think experiencing multiple things over the years and having witnessed my mom also, my mom I feel like is one of the most resilient women that has ever been alive in many ways. yeah, shout out to mom

Kristianna Mrjenovich (13:16)
Shout out to moms.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (13:18)
But seeing, I feel like optimism and that resilience runs in a strong lineage of women in my family. And I do think that in a certain way, our neuro spiciness aids us thriving in the chaos.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (13:38)
I would 100 % agree with that because I know personally I'm one of those people where like I will stress about the tiniest thing but you throw me into an emergency situation and I'm the calmest person in the room. I'm like okay well we're gonna X, Y, and Z and then this is gonna happen and I just go into go mode and then afterwards I'll be crying over like a hangnail and my husband's like I just watched you like get out of

situation and you're crying over hangnail or because you didn't get chicken nuggets for dinner like what is going on so this the neuro spicy I think you're onto something there

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (14:15)
Yeah, it's definitely a superpower and makes things more challenging at the same time. And that in itself probably aids resilience.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (14:26)
I would definitely agree with that. So one of the things that you've mentioned in your bio a little bit is, you know, being a voice for underrepresented voices and inclusion and redefining beauty standards and all of those types of things. Where does that come from within you?

Where would you say that kind of did something specific spark that? it your neuro spiciness and wanting to, you know, make others feel good? Or is there anything specific that caused that kind of gravitational pull?

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (15:05)
Several things.

I personally have experienced living in a body that's everywhere from a size two to a size 18. And having experienced living in different bodies, you understand the different things that come with living in different bodies and different aspects to that and start shaping how you see beauty as well, or at least for me, it really, I had to come to a place

acceptance at all all edges of the spectrum.

and shift from looking a certain way or pushing trying to look a certain way or achieve a certain aesthetic to accepting where I was at and feeling grateful for that and learning to treat myself better and focus more on nourishing my body, treating myself better, having more self -compassion, purposefully practicing

coping strategies of various sorts through stress management and.

you know, yeah, shifting, shifting that mindset for myself, definitely that came before pageantry for me, and before any of my, like before my magazine was born, before even my personal art brand was born. So that perspective definitely impacts everything that

So the magazine, Art Love Lifestyle, each seasonal issue has a theme focusing on the markers of what I call true beauty. I'm probably most passionate about expanding beauty standards and compassionate leadership. I could talk about both of them forever. But I really...

Pageantry helped me really refine my vision, clarify and refine my vision for that and set real goals towards seeing what I would like to see happen.

So I started Art Love Lifestyle as my personal art brand initially with the vision of maybe down the line I could have a magazine and with that those categories I could fit pretty much everything that I liked into any of those categories. when COVID happened that's another story of I guess resilience through I got long COVID I wasn't approved to work longer than four hour shifts so I

was normally working 12 -hour shifts and that ended up.

being the starting point for me leaving the Red Cross, actually. And during that time that I had COVID, I enrolled in a personal training course, a nutritionist course, and launched Art Love Lifestyle magazine.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (18:06)
feel like if my husband heard this conversation, he'd be like, so no wonder why you gravitate to Whitley because you're just like her because that I mean, that was me like last week when I had I had COVID like a couple weeks ago. And I've still been dealing with the repercussions of it. And normal people would relax when they have COVID. And that is when I officially actually launched the first episodes of this podcast

sitting there and doing nothing was not something I could do. I'm like, you know, we're going to launch the podcast right now. And he's like, you can't breathe. And I'm like, I don't need to breathe. Let's go. So that is ironic.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (18:38)
Exactly.

That's exactly like my husband's like, you're crazy. And my doctor actually did lecture me. So for anyone out there, take care of yourself. You only have so much energy when you have COVID and you might make yourself sicker. That's what my doctor was telling me. So yeah, so some of it might have been detrimental to my health.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (18:54)
I'm

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (19:08)
At the same time, was another, that completely shifted my direction. If I didn't have such strong restrictions, and it forced my job also to find a way to replace me, because at the time I was one of two charges, so I never would have left, because I would have been left my essentially work mom.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (19:09)
here we are, you have the magazine!

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (19:34)
hang in, you know. But through all of that, back to your question, all of that led to that passion. Entering the realms of pageantry made me question my worthiness. And when I was first recruited, it was literally the last thing that I ever would have expected.

I found it hilarious actually because at the time I had really long dreadlocks also, so it wasn't really the pageant aesthetic that I imagined. So, but I had a lot of questioning around

Kristianna Mrjenovich (20:13)
Yeah. You don't see dreads too much in the pageant world.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (20:27)
body, my curves, my stretch marks, my excess skin, you know, like things that were really the man of like really taught me about what I really saw the veil of beauty standards. It taught me a lot about also

My experience, and I think that this should probably be talked about more within, but it's hard because it involves our families, but how our mothers pass their own body insecurities down onto their children just by talking about their own bodies in certain ways.

But I had to peel back all those different layers. And then really what it came down to is like, as I was like picking apart all of the reasons I did not belong in pageantry, I was like, and actually maybe all of those things are exactly why I should go into pageantry. And so that was really, that was the defining moment for me when I went all in.

was like, actually, think people need to see people like me who have nerve damage in half of their mouth competing. Well, it's like, those are all the things that going into it. I think that a lot of us nitpick ourselves. We question our worth.

see beauty, the beauty industry in a very specific way. We have our own stereotypes that we've bought into around it. And so a lot of what I've loved actually is how pageantry has also proven me like not wrong, it's made me realize that no one really fits into the stereotype in pageantry.

There are people that strive toward that stereotype sometimes, I think with a misperception of not being able to win authentically.

But that's been a big part of my mission is both competing as an authentic person myself, as well as raising other authentic women leaders in pageantry through coaching. Because I have seen, I've seen the power of authenticity. People love vulnerability. They love authenticity. You can feel the genuineness and

Kristianna Mrjenovich (22:42)
Hehehehe

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (22:48)
it's important for people to represent authentically because really pageantry comes down to stage performance more than any kind of body in reality. Some of you're going to have your traditional people, but like I'm here for I'm like if I have a panel of.

like ultra traditional beauty industry and I get to talk about expanding beauty standards. That's like kind of amazing to me.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (23:16)
That's perfect. I know I've kind of mentioned it before, but you really were a steamroller and have made a huge impact already in the pageantry community by being a visible title holder. And I know I've kind of mentioned to you before, but I last year was at the International Miss Pageant, which shout out to International Miss because it's an amazing system.

But I was at that pageant watching in 2023 and obviously you were a title holder for 2022. So I didn't get to see you compete in crowns, but I did get to see you come back to crown your successor. And I remember I was sitting in the audience and I remember this like it was yesterday. It's why I feel so drawn to this system. And I'm like, I don't care if it takes 10 years. putting their crown on my head.

but I remember sitting in the audience and I saw you on the stage and I saw you on the giant posters that they have out in the front that you can take pictures on and I remember thinking, I know you're huge. I'm like, I'm gonna be there one day. But I remember seeing you and going, okay, there are so many things about her that are authentic and they're unique and they're beautiful.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (24:16)
It's crazy how big they made my airfaces

Kristianna Mrjenovich (24:32)
you had shorter hair, which is not something you typically see a lot of in pageantry. You see the long flowing curls, and I had shorter hair at the time. I still kind of do in pageantry standards, but you had a curvier body, and I have a curvier body, so I remember seeing she's got a real body. She's got curves to her, not that skinny people aren't real, but you can see that it's not a bought body, it's a real body.

and you had tattoos, which was one of my favorite things because I had it in my mind when I entered pageantry. That was one of the things that I said to myself, like, you'll never win because you have a bunch of tattoos. And then I go to that pageant and I see you up there and you have all your tattoos. And I was like, if they will crown Whitley, I might have a shot in this system. And I loved seeing that because it gave a huge sense of authenticity to international ms because it was

Okay, they're not looking for just the women who fit traditional beauty standards. They're crowning winners based off what's in their mind, what's in their hearts, and they're willing to look beyond what maybe the traditional

standards were. And that was huge. So you really were a pioneer for at least one woman because I don't think I would have dove back into the pageant industry after my first pageant experience.

if I hadn't had seen you, and then ironically, you volunteered at my pageant and I got to speak with you more, and you are very real. I can say you're a very genuine person, you're very authentic, and you come off that way, which is something that, like I'm not gonna toot my own horn, but people have said that I'm very similar, and I think it's the NeuroSpicy thing I really do, because...

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (26:17)
Yeah.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (26:19)
us NeuroSpicy people were just like, hey, friend, you know, we'll start talking to people and sharing our stories. But that was like one of the huge things was I got to spend time with you and see, okay, like she's a real person and she's out there doing all these crazy things, you know. So I do wanna say thank you on a personal level because I would not be where I am today checking off my goals if it wasn't for you and what you've pioneered. So thank you for

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (26:49)
So awesome. Thank you. I feel so honored. like, I like it.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (26:55)
No, but it's, it's, it's true. And it's real. And it was, it's amazing because there are, can relate something that you just said, especially to was you've been size two to size 18. And that was a huge thing for me too, because in high school, I was a size two and I was really small. And I kind of was busting into the model modeling industry and modeling world as a, as

tiny little itty bitty thing and then life happens, right? And I had three kids and my body is not what it was pre three children. And now I'm a size, you know, 14, 16. And I've had the same process that I think you've had where you're so many sizes and you experience life in so many different ways. You recognize the differences in not only how you feel about yourself and what you see internally,

but also how you're treated. mean, a lot of people don't like talking about it, but there is differences in how you're treated depending on how you look.

So I think it's definitely, it's so important that you're out here pushing in the pageantry world and beyond for different beauty standards because the average size of American women is up in the 14, 16 range. It's no longer like it was back in probably the 50s where everybody was a size two, four. It's just not like that anymore. So seeing more women that have.

post -baby bodies and that are out there with stretch marks and scars and all of that is really important, I think, for the pageantry world and the world in general, especially because we have systems like Miss USA that are now lifting age restrictions, they're lifting marital status restrictions, and they're saying, you know, come one, come all, come compete. So I think it's important.

for pioneers like yourself to be out there that are still pushing that envelope. Visibility is the word that comes to mind.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (29:01)
Yeah, yeah, I'm so glad that that's happened. know that there's questionable intentions behind the scenes, but I kind of see it as a win -win either way.

I feel like we're seriously limiting our vision of beauty through trying to keep a very specific aesthetic of beauty. If you go across cultures, like you can really see how beauty is defined in different ways across different cultures. And those beauty standards are impactful in every

No

beauty standard is. The beauty standard itself is limiting of beauty. And so we could all use, I feel like, more influence from one another, even understanding even just different cultural views around beauty. My favorite question to ask everybody is, you know, what true beauty is to them, because I ask that like for the magazine all the time, because I love doing part of how I like

elevate underrepresented voices is through featuring people both in print and then on the runway and giving voice to models of all shape sizes, backgrounds, abilities. So,

But seeing everybody's different view of beauty, it really is defined so differently from person to person. And it's beautiful to look through people's eyes and lens of beauty. And it helps expand your own because you're seeing it through different people's eyes. Nobody's view of beauty is wrong. You know, like we like to see beautiful things naturally as humans. Like our eyes really been self -correct to

to try to make things more beautiful than they are. That's something we learn about in art class because your eyes will start doing things like creating symmetry where there's not symmetry and creating shapes to emphasize certain angles and things like that. So they teach you tricks with how

Kristianna Mrjenovich (31:10)
wow.

That's cool.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (31:21)
learn how to do the opposite but I don't I think it's inherent in art.

in our humanity to want to see beautiful things. But I think we're limiting our views of beauty and like we there's so much beauty beyond the standards that I would love to see emphasized. Like I'm not against seeing beauty through different standards, I guess. I think that but I think my intention would be to have it expand as an expansive practice

in order to further create a standard. It's more to just, yeah, expand the standards.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (32:04)
I love that. And something that I feel like can aid that too, or something to point out, I guess, is for women that are competing that aren't necessarily the beauty standard is that, passion tree is so subjective. I mean, it really is such a subjective, and I know this from judging, I know you've recently been judging, and when you're sitting in that judge's table,

I feel like it really helps you in a lot of ways as a competitor because you're put in a hot seat and you're going, okay, what am I looking for as a judge? And so you start to critique the girls that you're judging and then you walk away and you go, okay, well I was looking for these things, but what I may be looking for is different than what you're looking for. So it's something that I think everybody needs to be reminded and I wish they

say that almost at every

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (33:01)
And often they'll create more purposefully to have a different focus too.

to a lot, yeah, like some, a lot of panels are put together as like someone who will be like hyper focusing on model, one person who's hyper focusing on modeling, someone who works for a news station that's gonna be thinking all about that interview and those concise responses. You're gonna have your former queens who have done the job and they're like.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (33:25)
Yeah.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (33:30)
tell me what you think this job is thinking. But that's where the beauty of judging is, that also you see like, I see how they put this together. And then you can also, you learn from the different judges themselves just by how they are as people.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (33:33)
Yeah, can you do it? Can you hold up to the pressure, you know?

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (33:54)
then you also learn from just seeing people back to back to back. And yeah, a lot of perspective, but there are definitely things that you start seeing, you're like, oh, okay. Cause you start figuring out to like, this is my 10, this is my nine, this is my eight. Judging this is a weird thing. And yeah, it's like sometimes even where you fall in line.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (33:59)
emerge.

Yeah.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (34:19)
It can work and I feel like hopefully it would work more in your advantage than not, but you know, if the judges don't know what they're.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (34:28)
what they're looking for, I guess, what their standard is. Yeah, if they're just kinda willy -nilly throwing numbers out there, which I have seen also as a judge, know, one person will be like, I like to dress more than the other, scribble, and then put a number, and you're just like, mm.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (34:29)
It is, yeah.

you

Yeah, but I think it's just, yeah, it just teaches, I feel like it's all a social experience. Like that's how I kind of treat so much of life is like, it's just, you you, cause you're going to have different perspectives. You're going to have judges that are some that are more emotional, some that are more like logical and, tangible minded that you're, so a lot of it really is subjective and.

as strategy, I just try to be real and fit in all of those things if possible. Like, here's some tangible things and here's some emotional things.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (35:17)
I think that's the best.

Mwahahahaha!

feel like that's smart though because one of the things that I've noticed, at least for me as an individual, is if I'm authentic and I'm myself, I'm way more confident and comfortable. And that's a huge thing is when I go into something, if I'm trying to fit a mold or I'm trying to fit a rubric or I'm trying to fit what I think they want, you're gonna see right through me because I...

Can I be polished? Absolutely. Can I be eloquent? Absolutely. But I'm always gonna be real and I'm always gonna be kind of goofy. So I come in with authenticity because the way I look at it, you're either gonna crown me because you like me or crown me or don't crown me if you don't like me. But I'm not gonna come in as something else because my reign, you're not gonna get that version of me that presented differently. I look at it like if I'm reigning for a year,

What you see is what you get So I feel like the authentic Message that you give is really important for women to hear because if you can't keep it up 24 7 for 365 don't do it

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (36:37)
Yeah, well, and if you're not being authentic to you're going to if you're trying to present as something different than you are, then you're going to be attracting people toward this image of you, not toward like your people too. So.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (36:53)
make sense. What would you say your definition of confidence is? If you could speak to girls and women right now and give your version of confidence and how you define it, what would you say it is?

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (37:06)
say confidence is stepping into your goals and practice or confidence comes through experience and practice so whether you feel that right now or not

it can come through just practice and experience and just try. Sometimes it's just a trust that it's coming. Like I know for me,

confidence really stems from within and it's a mindset over matter thing more than anything. But I do think that it has served me in the past too. When I, if I don't feel confident to try to imagine or almost

Kristianna Mrjenovich (37:44)
Agreed.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (38:01)
embody someone else that is like Beyonce.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (38:07)
I love that you said this though, because a huge part of my, I've recently launched a confidence workshop and I define my confidence building workshop by the word self, which is an acronym for four different things. And you just hit two of those things on the head. So self care is number one, because if you're not taking care of yourself, then you're not going to be confident.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (38:24)
Yes.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (38:34)
The second one is exercising your skills. So practice, which was a key thing of what you just said. Practice, practice, practice. Listen to positivity is L and then F is fake it till you make it. And I feel like that is a huge part of what you just said.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (38:48)
I love that you said that because I was literally going to say that exact phrase and I was thinking I don't have enough to cliche to say.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (38:54)
Yup! That's like...

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (39:01)
It really is it's like if you don't have confidence, just embody confidence from something else because like if I sometimes before stepping on stage, all the voices come in your head that shouldn't be there. So you might not feel the most confident right in that moment sometimes but if you are like, I am Beyonce, you go on you're like, I am Beyonce. So it can

Kristianna Mrjenovich (39:16)
Mm -hmm.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (39:31)
And then you feel more confident after because you were able to achieve it to then get those wins to through it.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (39:39)
Yeah, you walk off stage with like such a high too. You're like, I just did that. So even if you didn't walk on feeling like Beyonce, a lot of times I feel like you walk off and you're like, I just did that. So that

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (39:53)
exactly but I love your four pillars of confidence

Kristianna Mrjenovich (39:59)
Thank Thank you. Yeah, I just, I made the whole concept for the workshop. I've been debuting it in my community already and I'm seeing, I love doing these interviews because I'm seeing such a common thread in almost every woman that comes on this podcast. When I ask them that question, I get one of the four.

And I'm just like, I have this internal moment of yes, you're onto something because it just kind of lines up. So I love that you said that because that is one of the things actually that I haven't heard anybody say is that kind of fake it till you make it mentality. And it sounds kind of funny when you're saying like, I'm trying to teach you how to be confident, just fake it. It's as people that are very much like be authentic, you know, it's kind of opposite of that almost for a second. But I feel

I know I'm gonna walk on stage with Taylor Swift's I Can Do It With A Broken Heart, like playing in my head. Like that's gonna be probably my stage mental song because baby gotta fake it till you make it and it's so accurate.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (41:06)
As far as stage confidence, I think having like, just like you said, like the repetition aspect, but like having a stage song, I know that helps me too, because then also you get that song in your head no matter what plays.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (41:23)
Yeah. Yeah, I think officially Taylor Swift is gonna be my mental stage song for this year. I don't know what it'll be next year, but I'll be playing that on repeat in my head. So I can do it with a broken heart. That is gonna be the song that is just playing, because I'm gonna be like, we're gonna go out there, and a huge part

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (41:34)
Which Taylor Swift song did you say again?

Yes.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (41:49)
Pageantry that I've noticed with myself the biggest thing I struggle with is Imposter syndrome, which is terrible. I hate imposter syndrome, but it's such a Real thing. Absolutely, you know I I struggled a lot with last year being my first pageant and seeing all of these women and Going how the heck did I get a seat at this table? Like how did I pull this off? I don't know how I pulled this

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (42:00)
It's real.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (42:19)
And I had to kind of fake my way through it. And I remember at that pageant, I got top 20, which was awesome for my first pageant. But the biggest thing that I walked away with was the Iconic Impact Award and the recognition for what I did back at home. And I remember thinking like, this is better than winning for me. Because it was so validating internally of all the work that I did leading up to the pageant. And I went, okay, I earned that seat. You know, that was an award that

earned that seat. And now for international ms, I'm still carrying on that legacy, but I'm still struggling with that imposter syndrome. I mean, I'm looking and I have to stay off social media sometimes because I'm like, my God, this woman is a doctor that speaks six languages and she's beautiful and holy cow. And my gosh, this woman is traveling the world and she has a successful brand.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (43:05)
Yeah.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (43:14)
and this woman is running this company that all of these other pageant queens are involved with and it's like, holy crap, you start to think and then I have to kind of fake it in my head and I'm just like, I come in, I sit in this chair and I'm like, you know what? They don't have a throne.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (43:26)
That's also the beauty of

Exactly. Well, and everyone is so different. And like the thing about International Ms is really everyone is so accomplished. So like going into it so much as just like enjoying and being like, wow, I'm with like some of the most powerhouse women in all of the world.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (43:32)
That's what I have to tell myself.

Mm -hmm.

Yes. It's so empowering being among those women. Because you get in that mindset sometimes where you're like, imposter syndrome kicks in and you're like, how the heck am I going to pull this off? But then you start to think, I'm with these women. Like, I'm in the same room as these women. And you kind of have to flip how you're thinking. And then all of sudden, you find yourself going, OK, you know, like, I'm going to learn something from each one of these women.

And something that a friend of mine said at my last pageant when I was battling with the imposter syndrome, because being in pageantry, it's hard to beat at first. I feel like that is one of those things where you're not expecting it and then it lurches at you. And she said something along the lines of a rose and a sunflower are both beautiful flowers, they're just different in their own ways.

And I loved that, that stuck with me because when I start to fall into that trap, I'm just like, she's a Rosemum sunflower. Namaste.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (44:54)
I love that so

Kristianna Mrjenovich (44:55)
what type of tips would you give for someone like myself or someone else that is struggling? Is it really boil down to that fake it till you make it and just, you know, taking away what you can from

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (45:10)
Well, a lot, I think along the lines

not necessarily fake it till you make it, but drawing inspiration and like looking for inspiration, I think is very key. Looking for the lessons that you're supposed to learn through every situation. Like we talked about it on like a deeper level with like near -death experiences, but also from, you know, smaller things and even small refinements in performance, in interview, in...

any kind of, really any kind of, whether it's work, whether

in family, wherever you put your energy and your focus, that is going to grow. like, I know that's a saying as well, but it's really true. Like you're drawing attention to that matter. If you're focusing on your health, you're going to be more aware of ways that you are either hurting or benefiting your health. So that awareness is really key. I think getting real with yourself

and being humble is a good, genuine trait. And I think a lot of imposter syndrome sometimes is born out of almost a little too much humility. But it's also a self questioning of worth and of

And so something that I find with anything like, you know, me and my compassionate leadership thing, but a lot

Kristianna Mrjenovich (46:46)
Yes.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (46:49)
what the whole theory around that goes from shifting from focusing on the problem to focusing on solutions. If you shift your empathy and turn that into action, that starts to alleviate any of those feelings because you're starting to take action toward those goals. you are feeling, and it also shifts the energy of empathy or like

Kristianna Mrjenovich (46:59)
I love that.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (47:19)
fatigue if you shift it toward the alleviating part then it starts shifting from a stressful a stressful thing to a positive dopamine fulfilling activity instead but I also think you can be strategic around your

Kristianna Mrjenovich (47:37)
And we need those. Yes.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (47:49)
mental health, your own confidence. I think making plans, I think when you're in a good state, is one of the better things for any type of plan.

Like I just wrote an article or a blog for both my magazine, also for still she rose around research based strategies of overcoming suicidal ideation. I know that's a that's a deep topic, but.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (48:17)
I love that though.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (48:20)
you know, a big part of that is setting a suicide prevention plan while you're in a good state, because you know yourself the best too. So like, you know, your triggers also around what's causing imposter syndrome even like, you know, there's, you know, what's making me feel either not worthy or not enough or

that something might not be the fuller vision of what your big vision is. And so, you know, I feel like a lot of that's that is you want to be at your bigger vision when really you're like at these like baby steps up to that big vision. And because you're not here and you're like at a baby step, even though everybody's like, my God, like, cause to them, like your baby steps like up here. they're like, well, she's done.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (49:00)
Yeah.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (49:12)
And you're like, I'm just at this baby step down here.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (49:15)
I feel like that's a great perspective though, because a lot of times, a lot of us do downplay our achievements. I feel like that's such a broad spectrum. You have the people that downplay their achievements and they practice humility to a fault. And then you have the people that are on the other end of the spectrum that you don't want to be at either because nobody really wants to be around one of those people.

So feel like finding that balance that is an amazing point that people need to hear is your baby step might be a huge step to somebody else. And that's a really positive way to look

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (49:54)
of the time where you're at is also an answer to a former dream that you had as well. So that I know helps me find gratitude in my personal situations, even amongst challenges. But, you know, there's a couple of mantras that feel like that.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (50:01)
Mm -hmm.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (50:15)
help and it's yeah reminders and mantras but you know through the challenges I try to just remind myself that that's what's going to give me the lessons that I need to get to where I want to be and where I'm at it was at one point what I dreamed of so

Kristianna Mrjenovich (50:35)
is, I feel like that is such a huge insight and I love that because it can bring you back down to earth and kind of open your eyes. know, I even just having this podcast is something that, you know, somebody else might hear, she's got a podcast. That's really cool. And in my mind, I'm just like, I just have this small little podcast, you know, I downplay

And then someone else might be going, I had someone the other day that said, you know, I've really been wanting to do a podcast. Maybe I'll get with you and you can show me how you did it. And I'm thinking, you want to learn from me? That's amazing. So I feel like I needed that perspective, definitely. You helped me with that because just a couple of weeks ago, I was terrified of launching this podcast. I'm like, how do I hook my computer to my camera, to my microphone system and the lights and how do I do this? And now I've got people asking me

How do I launch podcasts? I'm like, come to my TED talk. I've got you. So that's an amazing insight.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (51:29)
Hahaha

You'll have to make a tutorial because now I want to learn.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (51:36)
Yeah, I got you. I feel like I'm learning the ropes for everybody and I can tell you what to do and not to do. I can tell you that the first time that you go on Amazon and you search your name in something, I'm sure art, like authors have this all the time where they find their book on Amazon and they're like, my God. But for me, was going on Amazon and searching and finding my podcast on Amazon. I was

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (51:39)
I'm sorry.

Hahaha

Kristianna Mrjenovich (52:03)
on Amazon so I could definitely type something out to help everybody.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (52:08)
love that.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (52:09)
So I'm going to switch gears because both of us are in an amazing organization or ambassadors for an amazing organization, the Still She Rose Initiative. And coincidentally, we are both the month of October. So we're going to be the ambassadors for October together. October is a great month.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (52:24)
There we go.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (52:28)
know you have so many things going for you. You've got the magazine, you've got, you know, True Beauty, you've got all of these things that are going on and that you work with and you advocate for. What can we expect to see out of you for your year as the Still She Rose ambassador? Is there anything you've already got like cooking in that brain of yours? Like this is what I want to tackle.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (52:54)
I'm, you'll definitely see a lot more blogs for me. It's something, cause I write a lot of articles for the magazine and especially, yeah, I'm like, all of it really kind of, every issue I have something that applies. So I'll be taking some of the things that I wrote about from,

different things and tailoring it to Still She Rose. So I'll be doing, yeah, kind of a blog series. I do have some things cooking that I cannot talk about quite yet, but yes, there will be things coming down the line. I do also have...

Kristianna Mrjenovich (53:30)
may be saying, hey Whitley, you need to come back on here and we need to talk about this thing you just launched.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (53:35)
Yeah. I'm very excited about an upcoming project with Still She Rose. And I will also though be releasing a compassionate leadership handbook and guided journal. So that's some exciting things. I've had those like I have

Kristianna Mrjenovich (53:45)
Yay!

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (54:02)
and my ADHD brain, multiple books in the works at simultaneously, depending on what I'm inspired by in that moment.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (54:05)
Heheheheh!

Same, girl! Same! Same! I have two manuscripts that I'm writing at the same time right now, so I relate!

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (54:21)
Yeah, but I'm gonna be like honing in on like actually completing a couple of those at least and getting those out. I'm also going to be part of, I'm a co -author in a book called Raining Resilient Queens. And so that will be coming out in the fall. So that's exciting. And then,

Kristianna Mrjenovich (54:48)
will be definitely reading

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (54:49)
Yeah, I'm excited. Yeah, it's different women from all different backgrounds sharing their stories of resilience. there are everybody has a powerful story and they're all so different. So it's a really neat project to be able to be a part of. We just went to Colorado. We did our Queen's shoot there. And for all.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (55:13)
love that state.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (55:14)
No, authors, Yeah, I love Colorado too. It was the shortest trip though. I wish that I could have gone longer, but next time.

I think that those are like the biggest things upcoming other than New York Fashion Week. yet.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (55:29)
coming. We might have to trade the podcast lessons for the how do I publish my book lessons because I have my first book literally written on my laptop and I'm like okay I have this idea and I've got it written and I just need to get it illustrated and published because it's a children's book and I'm like at that point where I'm like how do I do this? So we'll trade lessons.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (55:56)
Yes, definitely. I can help you with

Kristianna Mrjenovich (55:59)
Queen supporting queens. That is like one of my favorite things about pageantry in general is you meet so many women. I know still she rose one of the amazing queens that is another ambassador on there posted. She was talking about her book in one of the workshops that we had and I went on Amazon right away and I bought the last copy and I was like, girl, I got your last copy. And I had.

a queen reach out to me today that I've been friends with since high school and she's like, I just bought tickets to go to your pageant in September. And I'm like, my gosh. So the sisterhood with pageantry has been so much fun. It's, a lot of people I think feel like it might be like this mean girl type of thing behind the scenes because pageantry can get a bad

But I've had so many more positive experiences of women uplifting each other and being like, hey, your crown's crooked, I'ma fix it. Or hey, you did this thing, let me go support you. And that's been so amazing to see happen.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (57:05)
It's really true. That's what blew me away too, because I definitely came in with more of the TV stereotype, I will say, around pageantry. And yeah, it was just blown away at how real everyone is and uplifting and all the good, all the good things and yeah, just different types of people.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (57:32)
Yeah, it's so diverse.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (57:32)
that all go to a country. Exactly.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (57:36)
What am I doing for Still She Rose? So October is the Domestic Abuse Awareness

So I'm definitely gonna be focusing. I haven't decided specifically what I'm doing yet, but I know it's gonna be domestic abuse awareness related, because obviously that's my main platform. And something that I'm passionate about is domestic abuse. So ironically, that is why I was Mrs. Colorado. So you met me as I was Mrs. Colorado, and that

It's funny because I'm, you know, a born and raised Floridian. I've lived in Florida my whole 31 years. But I briefly moved to Colorado in 2016 when I was in the middle of my abusive relationship. And after a couple months, we wound up having to move back to Florida. But so when Florida wasn't available the year that I competed, because of Tanya being Miss Florida, love Tanya.

I'm like, yeah, I know, we love you, we love you, Tanya. I was like, well, what state could I represent? And my husband's home state was being represented by someone and I was like, Colorado. And ironically, that's what I reigned as, Mrs. Colorado. So when you say you were just out at Colorado though, it's beautiful and I love

But yeah, domestic abuse is the root of why I do all of my things now. So I'm gonna be focusing on October being domestic abuse awareness and domestic violence.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (59:05)
Yeah, I definitely expected that out of you. Yeah.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (59:07)
So,

Yeah, it's not a shocker

So yesterday I found out I was accepted as a member for the Florida Partnership to End Domestic Violence. So that is going to come in handy in October.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (59:23)
Yep, that's awesome.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (59:25)
So yeah, we'll have to coordinate somehow. We'll have to talk behind the scenes.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (59:32)
Yeah, we definitely will. That's the fun part of having a partner for the month.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (59:36)
Yeah,

is there anything that you want to shout out or any last statement that you want to leave as kind of your legacy statement or anything that you want to

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (59:48)
know, with all things that we do, think I really do believe that if we put things through the lens of compassion, both from compassion towards ourselves first, I think that that's the most important in order to feed others. You have to put your oxygen mask on first before you can put it on other people.

And then practice compassion towards the people around us, our pets, animals, toward the environment. I think that compassion truly can lead and successfully guide us to both confidence through understanding perspectives and practicing self -compassion, getting to know yourself.

self -discovery, all the things that go are involved in, in seeing things through a lens of compassion. I think that I personally believe that that would literally solve every problem in the world. So if anyone else would like to join me on that journey, can. I have.

project called the Compassionate Leadership Project that we also collaborate a lot with. She Rose. But feel free. It's just a free Facebook group you can join and you can follow it on Instagram and on Facebook. I'm not on Twitter. Sorry,

I also love to feature other people who...

who are practice compassionate leadership, but essentially trying to grow a global network of compassionate leaders

Like I do have some realms of compassionate leadership that we teach as well. So anyone who'd like to follow along with that, is. Otherwise, I guess just you can find me at Whitley Nubin

Marshall or Mind Body Compassion Coach

Kristianna Mrjenovich (1:01:52)
you so much for coming on this evening and for talking to us I love all of the messages that you shared and I think like Myself being inspired by you there will be plenty of other women that listen to this and can definitely relate So thank you so much for coming

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (1:02:11)
Thank you so much for having me. I just want to honor you and everything that you're doing. It's amazing to see this born and love hearing all the different stories of resilience and you sharing your own story. But it's powerful because through sharing vulnerability, lives change and people fall in love.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (1:02:17)
Thank

Thank you.

Whitley Nabintu Marshall (1:02:37)
with that and learn about themselves. just hope that you know that what you have started is bigger than you realize.

Kristianna Mrjenovich (1:02:47)
Aw, thank you. Don't make me cry.

you